Hey Tomas, I hope that at some point before the spring flying season you get a chance to work on the gov for nitro helis. Myself and others are still having issues. A selection under the gov tab for electric governor and nitro governor would be nice since they work best with different algorithms would be nice. Maybe licensing nitro gov algorithms from somebody else to save time could work too.

I have gone through literally everything that could be possibly wrong with my setup and there just isn't anything wrong. Everything runs great on throttle curves for now even without changing any engine tuning.

The nitro governor always sags in long maneuvers like loops and hurricanes even with holding performance at the maximum value of 6. And the engine overspeeds to 2250-2300 at times and holds it there even with lower governor response values. Other times switching between IU modes does nothing and the RPM stays the same. I have gone through nearly every gov value combination starting with 1 and 1 (response and holding). In the video I had posted on helifreak the response seemed OK but the holding performance was set to 6 and it was sagging badly in loops. Now I can't even get it to work at all without weird rpm changes and overspeeding.

I am not the only one having these issues. I am running an align magnetic sensor currently with both magnets set active. I am wondering if using two active magnets could be a problem, because I don't know if the align sensor or the spirit can handle reading from the sensor that fast (two magnets = between 30,000 - 34,000 magnet detections per minute). I will try to remove one magnet and flip it to inactive, but considering I had the same problems with a backplate sensor I'm not convinced this will help. Actually now that I think about it, the RPM readings in telemetry looked to be solid, because I used rpm telemetry to set my v-curves up. So I do not think this is a sensor issue

Hi,

thank you for the message. We are working on the improvements as usually. In the upcoming update there will be some changes especially for smaller helicopters and extended ranges.
On the other hand we are testing for long time with pilots that are flying with nitro helicopters. From ours and their tests we have found concluded that the performance is of at least competitive products in demanding maneuvers and superior in low head speed setups.
For this reasons we think that the problem is not in the algorithm of the governor itself. Rather we think that it is all related with RPM signal processing and possibly with governor spoolup procedure.
If something is working wrong there, the entire governor will not operate correctly whatever algorithm is used. Of course our aim is to get as good as possible performance on any type of motor with upcoming updates. So you can expect updates in all areas.

Since we wish to definitively find the issue as fast as possible we will be testing with more models and a different sensors too. Our focus is at a different areas currently but from the beginning of next update we will work just on this.

For now the only thing I would like to know is - if you can fly with throttle curve with as stable RPM as possible, can you capture the RPM readout from telemetry to see how stable the reading is? This will show us the quality of the RPM readout. Then it will be easier to find the issue.

If I am not wrong, are you using this sensor at the moment?
http://manual.spirit-system.com/index.p ... RPM_Sensor

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Spirit System developer

I will be flying this upcoming weekend and will try to capture what I see- as far as I recall the RPM readings via telemetry looked to be quite stable on throttle curves in a hover and on the ground when I was setting my throttle values for running ungoverned. When I looked at the telemetry on the governor, RPM was changing a lot with inputs, but proportionally to what I was hearing from the engine. I have RPM filter set to the default of 6. When I tried other values, both lower and higher, the problems only got worse. When setting gains, this time I started with both at 1. At 1 for response, giving quick collective caused headspeed to sag as expected with such a low value. At 2, the same thing happened. At three it was overshooting, but with a delay (rpm sagged during the collective input, and as soon as I stopped the heli the rpm then shot up). At 4, headspeed was overshooting and hanging there for a few seconds after stopping all inputs. Similar was happening with holding performance. It was possible to set values high enough that it held well during tic tocs, but as soon as you stopped them the headspeed stayed high. Yet at the same time it was still bogging in loops and other prolonged moves with a constant steady load.

I've thoroughly checked and tested the rpm sensor and it is all working properly (and telemetry was showing it properly of course).

Thank you very much.

It is very interesting what you have said about Governor Response. Normally there is no reason for such delay.
Actually when using just Governor Response it should work at least as with well tuned Throttle Curve.

When trying on the ground, you may see that the throttle servo arm is moving as when you are moving with the collective pitch.
This movement should be instant as with V throttle curve (the bigger the value is, the bigger difference you can see).

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Spirit System developer

This behavior was new and strange. I had the governor working at least well enough for basic flight other than the long term holding, up until the day I messed with the RPM filter setting. Even though it is set back at 6 where it was before I messed with it, the governor has never been the same since.

Very bizarre. Gov response did work fine before, holding performance used to be the only issue. I really have no idea what happened. The engine is not leaning, there are no leaks, everything is well sealed.

Were there any changes in the wiring?
I mean whatever that possibly changed on the helicopter, especially some changes in the sensor wiring.

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Spirit System developer

Nope, no changes to everything, all wires checked, everything working properly. I'm almost tempted to reset the unit and start over with setup and see if that helps.

Thank you for the info.
If you are not aware about anything that changed than the only things that could change are in the mechanics.
In the unit there is nothing that could change on its own as there is nothing rotating, mechanical that could wear or move.
So if anything I recommend to check especially the sensor wiring.
If it worked much better and now it is not working, then something changed for sure.

Using factory reset will unfortunately not help if all the values will be configured with same values. There is nothing that is hidden inside the unit. So anything you can see in the software is the only things that can change it.
Sensor Filter should not change it to that extent as well. But if anything, you can try to set it at 0 or 1. This will reduce any possible delay.

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Spirit System developer

The day I decided to try changing the sensor filter parameter, the lowest I went down to was 2. From 2-5 it caused the engine rpm to pulse up and down slowly (probably about 200-300 rpm variations).

I will be spending the entire weekend at our flying field so I'll investigate further. In any case, even when it was working (response gain at least) holding performance for long maneuvers was not good. It held well in tic tocs but not in loops and hurricanes. But at the same time it was causing rpm to hold too high if you loaded the head a lot.

Great.
If the head speed does not drop immediately after load ends, then it mean that throttle max value is configured too high where carburator is over its 100%.
By decreasing the value it should be possible to fix it perfectly. Did you tried this too?
If it is lets say at 110%, then by this you allow governor to use additional 10% of the travel. But at that time it is already at 100% and after longer load it takes time to go down from 110 to for example 70% while during these 10% it will be just fully opened and it will look like nothing is happening, just fully opened throttle.

If there will be still the overspeeding issue, then it could be solved easily with firmware update. In the upcoming version there will be parameter for limiting Holding Performance. This limit will solve the overspeeding however the throttle max is configured as it will behave as a virtual limit.
We have beta firmware for testing, so if you wish we can provide it. Otherwise it will be available once the update is released officially.

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Spirit System developer