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PostPosted: Sun 07. May 2017 18:41:41 
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Joined: Mon 17. Apr 2017 16:45:45
Posts: 8
ZeXx86 wrote:
jarhart: because if you will hold the position, it can be in absolutely any position - you can't expect what it will be and what consequences it will cause.
If there is single configured position, you will always know. Adding more points of certainty can always minimize possible damages.


Adding more points of certainly only makes the outcome more certain, not necessarily less dangerous. Yes, with zero pitch you always know what the pitch will be in a failsafe situation, and you know it will be a DANGEROUS one because it will maintain the energy in the rotor. The spinning rotor blade is what sends people to the emergency room (or worse.) This should be our ONLY concern!

With hold position, it's not random, it's whatever you were doing, so the helicopter will keep doing what it's already doing but only for a few seconds because without power the rotor will stop spinning quickly, then the helicopter will just fall. This isn't a thought experiment. Smarter people than me have concluded after years of testing that throttle cut and position hold is the safest failsafe, which is why it's so often the default.

ZeXx86 wrote:
Next reason is, that if you will set non zero pitch that is too high, it will very likely also cause boom strike at the impact which mean next major damages even if the rotor is not spinning at all - this is possible to prevent.


If I've lost control of something that can kill somebody, my only concern is preventing injury.


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PostPosted: Sun 07. May 2017 19:10:15 
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Joined: Mon 29. Apr 2013 16:06:44
Posts: 12442
Thank you for your message.

With rescue and moderate pitch angle you can do all at the same time:
- stop the rotor
- level the helicopter
- minimize damage

With hold the helicopter can still perform any maneuver for approx. 0 - 4 seconds, because when your collective pitch is in the middle (e.g. tic toc) or it is in the same direction as the previous movement you will loose head speed only slowly.
So the hold is only lottery where you can be only sure that the throttle will be cutted.

Imagine just simple loop - if your rotor has enough energy and you are in the middle of the loop, it will CONTINUE to do this loop without controlling it. And in the end, it can very well end above the pilot.

So if you care about safety activate the rescue at the same time. Moreover, you can even try this condition with autorotation bailout.

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PostPosted: Sun 07. May 2017 21:16:27 
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Joined: Tue 15. Sep 2015 1:16:16
Posts: 28
ZeXx86 wrote:
Thank you for your message.

With rescue and moderate pitch angle you can do all at the same time:
- stop the rotor
- level the helicopter
- minimize damage

With hold the helicopter can still perform any maneuver for approx. 0 - 4 seconds, because when your collective pitch is in the middle (e.g. tic toc) or it is in the same direction as the previous movement you will loose head speed only slowly.
So the hold is only lottery where you can be only sure that the throttle will be cutted.

Imagine just simple loop - if your rotor has enough energy and you are in the middle of the loop, it will CONTINUE to do this loop without controlling it. And in the end, it can very well end above the pilot.

So if you care about safety activate the rescue at the same time. Moreover, you can even try this condition with autorotation bailout.


Hi Tomas,

You are right, tic toc and simple loop will not be so dangerous.

Look at this video, at 0:30 Tim make some moderate pass front of him. This is the kind of situation where the 0 pitch is not safe, it can project the beast on someone like a missile. This is what we are talking about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqKGMGjOP4s

I'm not confident the rescue will be fast enough to climb the helicopter
away before it hit someone.

Just my 2 cent


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PostPosted: Sun 07. May 2017 21:28:07 
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Joined: Mon 10. Oct 2016 0:45:02
Posts: 100
Just my 2 cents I don't think it's safe for a pilot of any skill level to be doing those maneuvers
that close to himself or any spectators.


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