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SOLVED Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
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Author:  Fortune7 [ Sun 23. Aug 2020 19:50:30 ]
Post subject:  SOLVED Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
Hi,

I've been struggling with this problem since swapping-out a BeastX unit for a new Spirit RS and Geolink, on a Trex 500L. All is well in normal flight, but when selecting either:

Stabilisation
Rescue
Geolink RTH

the heli quickly rolls left about 70 degrees and stays there until de-selected, which restores normality. Unfortunately I don't have a big enough space at home to test so it's taking a while as I 'make a change then go fly' at the field. On the bench, the swashplate doesn't tilt but in the air, and afterwards after landing, it does. I realise the problem could be isolated by disconnecting / de-selecting the Geolink and I'll try this next to see if it's that or the Spirit.

So far I've checked / done the following:

My stabi settings against the settings of other SpiritRS - equipped helis - nothing different
The (Jeti DS-12) transmitter for any spurious logical switches, mixes, etc.
Done a re-calibration of the Geolink (twice) to ensure reliable position fix, etc.
The Geolink 'home' position as either a known map point (100% travel on RTH channel), or as takeoff point (50% travel on RTH channel)
Checked the telemetry for unusual spectrum analyser values - nothing obvious found
There's no fan on the CC Talon 90 ESC.

And today after flying:

Re-flashed the Geolink firmware v1.2 (it was already)
Levelled the heli so that the SpiritRS unit ('Horizontal 0') is perfectly level in both axes and performed a recalibration of the unit (ctrl+alt+u). Now the unit reads (from ctrl+alt+m) -4, -2, 2065. Before, it was -8, 141, 2056

Tomas, can you confirm this procedure is ok for the SpiritRS, please? Your post from June says:

Ideally the values should be near 0 0 -2048 +/- 100 (for all Spirit units except Spirit 2/RS).

so I'm not sure if this applies to the RS. Settings file attached if it helps.

Hopefully one-or-more of these changes will solve the issue. As always, any help or suggestions appreciated!

Cheers, Andy

Attachments:
AndyTrex500L.4ds [255 Bytes]
Downloaded 50 times
Author:  ZeXx86 [ Mon 24. Aug 2020 9:07:22 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
Hello,

I can confirm this procedure is correct.
The values are looking good, if your model/unit is really level during calibration. But since we are doing calibration for each unit, it was rather not needed. It can be useful especially for old units.

I recommend to just test carefully with Coaxial/Stabilisation mode since it will affect also all other modes including GeoLink features and Rescue.

This page can be helpful for you:
http://manual.spirit-system.com/index.p ... ise_Rescue

You can try to enable Extended signal processing in the Expert Settings or if it will not help, then Stabi Correction.
Author:  Fortune7 [ Tue 25. Aug 2020 8:39:46 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
ZeXx86 wrote:
Hello,

I can confirm this procedure is correct.
The values are looking good, if your model/unit is really level during calibration. But since we are doing calibration for each unit, it was rather not needed. It can be useful especially for old units.

I recommend to just test carefully with Coaxial/Stabilisation mode since it will affect also all other modes including GeoLink features and Rescue.

This page can be helpful for you:
http://manual.spirit-system.com/index.p ... ise_Rescue

You can try to enable Extended signal processing in the Expert Settings or if it will not help, then Stabi Correction.
Many thanks, Tomas - very helpful.

I do understand about the unit's initial factory calibration and that it's not recommended to change this unless absolutely necessary. I did it because (1) it's easy and (2) because I could guarantee a very accurate level datum for the unit.

My problem is likely elsewhere BUT I'm interested in your thoughts about the calibration numbers. You said in an earlier post that correct calibration should be 0, 0, 2048 +/- 100, which the new figures are. However before calibration they were -8, 141, 2056 (confirmed set level).

Do you think the 141 number could indicate an issue? It would be good to know for interest only.

In any case, I'll try your suggestions (thanks) when the weather improves.

Cheers, Andy


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Author:  ZeXx86 [ Wed 26. Aug 2020 9:53:30 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
I think the new calibration will not change the behavior. Difference is very small. Also it does not mean your values are more precise.
Model itself might be not standing precisely at the table and there can be tollerance in levels. Maybe you have used a bubble level which in some cases are far from precise.
Anyway it will not cause also any harm since the difference is so small.

In some cases there are very big vibrations, especially at Y axis which can cause the troubles.
Author:  Fortune7 [ Sat 29. Aug 2020 19:23:49 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
ZeXx86 wrote:
I think the new calibration will not change the behavior. Difference is very small. Also it does not mean your values are more precise.
Model itself might be not standing precisely at the table and there can be tollerance in levels. Maybe you have used a bubble level which in some cases are far from precise.
Anyway it will not cause also any harm since the difference is so small.

In some cases there are very big vibrations, especially at Y axis which can cause the troubles.


You were right, Tomas, the new calibration didn't fix the problem but at least I can take it off the list of possible causes!

Today I flew the heli again and it's still the same (hard left bank when operating Rescue or Stabilisation). I disabled Geolink in Settings (+save) and disconnected it - no change, so it isn't that.

Back home I have been comparing the settings of this model with my Goblin 770, also with Spirit RS, and using the same controls / switches, etc. The Goblin does not have this problem, yet all the channels and setup areas are the same, in terms of diagnostics. I have looked in detail at both the Jeti Model file (transmitter) and the Spirit settings (fbl) for each model to try to see where the difference is, and therefore the problem. I can't find anything.

It's been suggested that vibrations are the cause. Looking at the telemetry 'S Vibes' from the SpiritRS the value is a fairly constant 40% +/- 5%. This is similar to my other helis, so I can't see it is excessive. I can post the graph if necessary.

I'm out of ideas now that I have worked logically through all I can. Yes, I accept this will still be something I did, or didn't do, but until I fix it, I don't feel confident to fly the model as, for me, Rescue and RTH are essential features at my stage of flying, and eyesight!

Questions:
1. Is there a program or app that will allow the comparison of 4DS setup files?
2. For Jeti users, is there a program or app that allows the comparison of model files?

My long-winded comparison has involved writing all relevant settings down for both models, and looking for differences....

Perhaps a full 'factory reset' of the SpiritRS will help and re-build all the settings. It's the only thing I haven't done.

As always, any suggestions or advice is appreciated.

Cheers, Andy
Author:  ZeXx86 [ Sat 29. Aug 2020 20:41:39 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
Hello,

yes, please attach vibration plot especially from Y axis with tail blades on ideally.

Did you try what I written in the previous post?
Author:  Fortune7 [ Sat 29. Aug 2020 22:44:50 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
ZeXx86 wrote:
Hello,

yes, please attach vibration plot especially from Y axis with tail blades on ideally.

Did you try what I written in the previous post?


Hi Tomas,

Here attached is the vibration file for the Y axis. I have checked the main shaft for straightness (in lathe, with test indicator) and it is OK. Perhaps I should get new tail blades, although the plot with/without them is similar.

As to the other tests:

Yes, I went through the document "Rescue/Stabilisation is imprecise during flight" with the following feedback:

1. Diagnostic tab - swashplate corresponds with stick movement
2. The SpiritRS unit is confirmed aligned in all 3 axes (horizontal 0, connectors at the back)
3. Vibration analysis - see attached
4. There is no fan on the ESC

I went through the process of re-levelling the swashplate and checking at the 'Servos/SubTrim(tuning)' part of the setup. It was around 0.2 degrees out so I re-levelled to zero very carefully.

Please note that now, with a pitch gauge fitted and after initialisation (heli levelled precisely), when operating Rescue, the swashplate g tilts 9 degrees to the left, motor NOT running. I think this is the basis of the problem, but after all the above checks, and those before, I can't understand why.

Extended signal processing was NOT enabled before, but is now
Stabi correction is enabled, and was before.

Again, I appreciate your help Tomas - many thanks.

Andy

Attachments:
500Lvib.png
500Lvib.png [ 89.46 KiB | Viewed 354 times ]
Author:  denis747 [ Sat 29. Aug 2020 23:26:12 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
Your tail rotor vibration is very high according to that picture.

Look at the diagnostic tab/spectrum analyser section of the manual:
Quote:
Generally, the vibrations are the highest on Y axis (aileron) but we recommend you check all axes each time you are doing measurement. However vibrations should not exceed 50% for all axes at any time. In the case vibrations are at 90% or more, the model has an issue that needs to be rectified. Should the magnitude exceed 90% on any of the given axes, it is recommended to fix whatever issue is causing these extreme vibrations before flying the model. Even though Spirit FBL unit is highly resistant to vibrations, these could cause unwanted interactions


Quote:
Vibration levels:

Vibrations up to 50% - vibrations at a normal and acceptable level

Vibrations between 50% and 90% - raised vibration levels

Vibrations exceeding 90% - extreme vibration levels

As well as overall vibration levels not exceeding 50%, any specific frequency (peak) should not exceed 50%. Anything above this level should be cause for concern and requires further investigation




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Author:  Fortune7 [ Sun 30. Aug 2020 0:23:32 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
Yes, agreed - thanks. I'll work on reducing the tail vibration and will be pleasantly surprised if it fixes the issue, particularly as I still have the swashplate tilting left on "Rescue" without the motor on, after a fresh, level initialisation. Stranger things have happened, though, and I've been 'surprised' before!

Cheers, Andy

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Author:  denis747 [ Sun 30. Aug 2020 0:40:38 ]
Post subject:  Re: New Spirit RS and Geolink - stabi / rescue / RTH issue
The high vibes will make the swashplate tilt if you selected rescue after a flight (after the blades have safely stopped). For the swashplate to tilt left, on rescue, after a fresh initialisation there must be something else also not right.

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